Genius and MTV have teamed up to bring you a new look into New York hip hop from ‘97 to ‘98. MTV has dug deep into their vaults and found three gems, each never before seen in its entirety. As part of an ongoing project, MTV is looking to the Genius community to add context and personal stories to these interviews with some of the all time greats.
Here we have the first release in the ongoing collaboration between Genius and MTV. Newly uncovered, this unedited 1997 interview shows Dirty in a rare light, revealing struggles with family life and staying clean. Watch the ever compelling ODB drop science like only he could and see why there was no father to his style.
Interview by Josh Tyrangiel
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Interviewer: And, anytime you’re ready. So, Dirty, the reason that you’re here today – we’ve heard a lot about changes that you have made in your life for the past couple of months. Why don’t you kind of explain to me what’s going on?
Dirty: I don’t know man, just boy. Changes. Well, it’s like – you know, I don’t know, something about the children, you know? You know it’s just – I can’t really explain it but it’s all good though
Interviewer: Let me start with the kids. How many kids do you have and what about the most recent child made you kind of stand up and take note?
Dirty: The kids – how many kids do I have? Well, all the kids in the world is mine, so I can’t count how many kids I’ve got. All the children in the universe is mine, everywhere, you know what I mean? But it’s just – hey, the kids love Dirty, you know what I mean? Every time they see Dirty they smile, you know what I mean? And that’s automatically made dirty smile, you know what I mean? Make me want to get on my knees and play Lego blocks with them and everything, so it’s all good
Interviewer: Well, let me ask you about this most recent child. I guess the most recent, I guess is it a son, who was born to you? It’s your 13th child and from what I was told that made you kind of stop and say, take a little stock of where you are in your life and what you need to do for them. Is that true?
Dirty: Yeah, yeah, a little. Prince Osiris is here. And you know, it just like – I just want the right things for them, you know what I mean? And then have them, you know have they head on pointe, you know what I mean? And just want the best for them, you know what I mean? Just like any parent want for their children
Interviewer: What’s your relationship like with your kids? I know what there are a lot of them, but let’s say on a regular basis with most of your kids, are you there are much as you can be? I mean, how does that work?
Dirty: I’m there as much as I can be, you know what I mean? I see them, I talk to them on the regular. I mean, they crazy about their dad, there’s no doubt about it, and their dad is crazy about them too. They all look like me, little bad asses
Interviewer: How do you explain to them, when they call you ‘dad,’ how do you explain to them who Ol’ Dirty Bastard is, who Osirus is. I mean, do you kind of sit with them and explain things?
Dirty: No, I don’t explain. I mean, they’re my children, you know what I mean? They know me as Dad, you know what mean? Ol’Dirty Bastard, that’s like a job – you know what I mean? Osirus is like a job too, you know? It’s like, I don’t know. I feel it, it feels me, so it’s all good
Interviewer: I want to talk a little bit about this most recent incident, as it were. You were arrested last week and there was a charge that you hadn’t paid a fair amount of child support. Can you kind of tell me one, exactly what happened and two, whether that’s true
Dirty: Well one, I was signing autographs and I got picked up by the cops. Two, well, I love my – all my, I love my wife, yes, I love her dearly. Of course I pay child support, you know what I mean? Why wouldn’t I, you know what I mean? I love my children just being there as a family, you know what I mean? You know, things just got to be dealt with, you know what I’m saying? They have to things that I have got to deal with and that’s what got to be dealt with. And we will deal with it. The creator will make sure everything is right
Interviewer: I mean, the amount that is in question they are saying is about $35,000, which most people would I guess presume that rappers make a lot of money and that $35,000 would not be – you know. Is it necessarily true that you’re swimming in money as ODB and you can just pay things off left and right and two, is that the correct amount of money? And what do you plan to do about it?
Dirty: [inaudible - 00:04:42] you know, want to correct all situations, you know what I mean? So you know, we keep it moving as love, you know what I mean? There wasn’t nothing on my shoulder. And no, Dirty don’t have a lot of money, you know what I mean? Dirty is so busy giving out things, you know what I mean? Money don’t really mean nothing to me, but I’ve got to have it for the children of course. That’s why I’m getting this together, you know what I mean? So I don’t have to be hearing this and hearing that and things of that nature. I know times is hard and I know we’ve all got problems, but I don’t know, man. I just love all, man, you know what I mean? I will leave it in the hands of the creator, like I said
Interviewer: Your wife has said that she wants to kind of divorce you and kind of move on after this incident. Is that something that you hope you can work out?
Dirty: Of course, of course. I mean, we have been together for so long and you know, divorce, that’s like – that’s like, you know on Sunday when Moses departed the Red Sea, you know what I mean? But it had to come back together again, you know? And it had to stay together, you know what I mean? Can’t no problems can be so bad that things can’t be still good, you know what I mean? I’ve just got to make it better, you know?
Interviewer: How long have you guys been together?
Dirty: About 13 – yeah. I love the girl, man. Well, I love her to death, true
Interviewer: You said before that you’re trying to get this thing together. You’ve had problems in the past with alcohol and drugs. At what point did you realize that you can’t do that anymore?
Dirty: When I heard really that Otis Redding had crashed into that sea. That’s my main man, nah, just bullshitting. It was just – you know what I’m saying, I ain’t gonna say that, you know, it’s just – I learned that it’s not the move, you know what I mean? That ain’t the move where it’s time to have a straight point, straight ahead. You know what I mean? We’re doing things because that’s like that’s life, it’s serious. You know what I mean? You ain’t here, you don’t which way...what will..but loose. You know? So I know I’ve got to be here. And as far as all that alcohol and drug stuff, I advise ya’ll not to mess with it. And you hear from Dirty, take it as is. I ain’t saying – I’m just giving advice, that’s all. Like I give myself that same advice
Interviewer: Was there anyone who took you aside at any point and said Dirty, you’ve got to straighten out – one, for yourself, two, for the group, three for your family? Or did this just kind of come to you, you know, alone?
Dirty: It came to me alone, really. Because it’s me that make it happen, you know what I mean? I mean, people can give advice, you know, all your lives – you know what I mean? But it’s really up to you to make things happen and change. And for those who does do it and they don’t want to stop, that’s not how you do it, you know what I mean? Don’t let things control your mind, word. Word
Interviewer: You said that it’s not going to be 100%, you can’t commit to quitting
Dirty: Nah, put it this way man. I ain’t going to lie, because I ain’t no liar. When I’m onstage, something about that red wine, man. You know, it just bring the brilliance. I mean. But I ain’t doing it in a while, though, that’s what’s bugging me the hell out, you know what I mean? I ain’t one to lie, man, you know? I mean, we all do our things and everything, you know what I mean? Ya’ll know me for being raw, so I gotta keep it raw. If I’m onstage and it’s a good show and a lot of people I might take a sip or two, you know what I mean? That’s what brings the energy, you know? But then again, I might not. You know what I mean? I didn’t yet, so that’s something that I feel that I’m going to keep up, word. Keep that inside, you know what I mean? Nah, matter of fact, I’m not – that’s the move. Leave that alcohol alone, that’s the move, word
Interviewer: How long has this been going on? How long have you been sober?
Dirty: For about two months now, yeah
Interviewer: What’s been the effect? I mean, as far as your relationship with your kids and your family, I am sure they have noticed a difference in you
Dirty: Yeah, it’s like – it got closer, you know, being that I do a lot of touring and things of that nature. Wifey want to be around me, you know what I mean? And I understand that. But you know, I have got a job to do also. And being that I have got a job to do, sometimes that implants thoughts, you know what I mean? And it’s all natural, you know what I mean? For thoughts to be implanted, you know. I love you, girl. Keep that in mind, you know what I’m saying? And whatever you do, I’m always going to love you, regardless. So it’s like that
Interviewer: How is this change going to affect what you’re doing musically? I mean, a lot of people expect a certain thing of ODB at this point. You have been around a couple of years. How is it going to change your focus and how is it going to change what we’re going to hear?
Dirty: It’s going to keep my thoughts together, that’s one. You know what I mean? It’s like this – being, for me being sober, it reminds me when I was a kid again. You know what I mean? Being able to have a clear mind, that’s all, you know what I mean? To me, I ain’t going, you know what I’m saying – hold on, that shit’s weird though, because I really did nothing like this before. God is good, God is definitely good. Word. He definitely good, man, he got it going on baby love
Interviewer: Talking about being a kid – do you remember your first experience with alcohol – I mean, how old were you and where were you and who introduced you to things?
Dirty: I don’t remember but it was there. And I drunk it and you know, at that time it was there. You know what I mean? It’s not there no more. It’s not there no more
Interviewer: Tell me about the next solo album stuff, what you’re working on, what it’s going to sound like, how the new you is going to be reflected in that
Dirty: I want a lot of rock and roll artists on it. I don’t know who, how, other than I like a couple, several. I ain’t going to name no names because I don’t want, you know – but I like the rock and roll. My album is going to be called Dirty’s World, I believe. I want to cover several artists on there, Mariah, for one – that’s my sweetheart, word. And you know, a couple of artists. Basically, I don’t know what’s going to happen. You know what I’m saying? I’m just happy to be here, you know what I mean? It’s came to a little change and it’s all good. I just gotta keep it up, you know what I mean? I ain’t here to throw no punches or nothing like that, just got to keep it up, that’s all. Keep a clear mind and keep it moving, that’s basically it. You know what I mean?
Interviewer: How have the guys in the Clan responded to you? I mean, have you gone and spoke to them about you’re making some changes in your life?
Dirty: No, I don’t really speak too much nowadays, you know what I’m saying? Basically, I ain’t really trying to talk on the results, you know what I mean? I just want to show and prove it, you know what I mean? Right now, the Clan, I don’t know. Well check it out, Dirty is here, Dirty is here to stay, word. And we are going to make these albums and we are going to get this money and we are going to take care of these kids and all my children across the universe. I love you all, keep it up, keep it good, keep it in school. Keep it high levels. Low levels, keep it inside. And the women, I love ya’ll, ya’ll got it going on. All my n***as, I love ya’ll, gotta keep it moving. And I love you, mama, I love you dearly. You definitely got it going on, word. Definitely, word. Thanks for bringing me here, word
Interviewer: Dirty, let me ask you a little bit more about Wu Tang. When the tour was going on with Rage Against the Machine, RZA was say-, when it got called off, RZA was basically saying that he was upset that a lot of the guys in the group didn’t make all the dates. And although he didn’t mention you by name, it was pretty clear who he was talking about. Has that been sorted out at all?
Dirty: Yeah, I was going through – me personally, I ain’t going to lie. I was there, I was there, and I was there. You know, but I know that my clan needs me. They need me like I need them, you know what I mean? The world needs me, period, word, because I need the world. You know what I mean? And I know that because I have got a lot of love for everything. And when you have got a lot of love for everything, love is needed. You can kind of like teach a lot of people that don’t see certain things, you know what I mean? Instead of bad, it’s all good, you know what I mean? It will come in time, though, but basically, I ain’t really a talker. I’m just happy to be here, baby. You know what I mean? I ain’t even a talker, man. I talk too much. Who knows what’s gonna happen
Interviewer: Who tells you that you talk too much?
Dirty: Well look, man, it’s like this – nobody will tell me nothing, it’s just you can feel when you’re talking too much. You know what I mean? It’s just, oh boy. N***a please. All this can’t camera stuff, I ain’t really used to this stuff. I’m used to it but then again I ain’t used to it. I’m used to being myself, natural. Laid back and being all stiff all the damn time, you know? Just ask me some more questions, man
Interviewer: Is it hard for you to believe, four or five years ago your life was 100% different than it is now. Is it hard for you to believe that you’re sitting here talking to MTV. Does it still come over you sometimes that you’ve come a long way?
Dirty: Yeah, word
Interviewer: What do you feel at those times?
Dirty: Well, it’s just like I see things more clearly now, you know? I mean, I always saw things in weird ways, it’s just a little clearer now. It’s more tight now, you know? Everybody don’t understand what I’m talking about, just talking about life itself, you know? I ain’t trying to make no statements on TV, man. All the children belong to me, man. Some say 13, some say – I ain’t, look, hey – you know what I mean, all the children belong to me, for real. It ain’t no lie, I love all. Sometimes bad things happen, you know? For the bad things, sorry about them. You know, I guess that what occurs when you lazy, you know? That’s why that change occurs and shit
Interviewer: A lot of people would say you have got 13 kids, what about birth control? Are you going to maybe start using condoms or is that not -
Dirty: I use condoms. Oh man, oh baby I like it raw. Yeah, condoms – yeah, I use condoms, yeah. Birth control, yes, birth control. Birth control. Yes, ladies and gentlemen, birth control. Do some birth control. Look, Dirty, yeah, birth control. Man, I was just speaking about birth control. Look, I love you all. Birth control. I love you all and birth control is good and if you don’t want to have no babies like that and you don’t want to run into them problems, boy – I mean, babies all over the universe. Boy, if you don’t want to run into no problems, you better listen to that TV, baby. That’s real. Oh boy, you better listen
Interviewer: So are you going to start taking some of that advice yourself?
Dirty: Well, of course. Man, of course. I was just thinking, man, I be having nightmares and everything, they’re coming to get me. And just avoid all future, all future stuff, you know what I mean? I just want to let ya’ll know, like I said before, I love ya’ll man. [Inaudible - 00:19:59], all right? For real. Because ya’ll the only ones I’ve got. I don’t got nobody else, anybody. A lot of people care, but you know – we are all we got, for real. You know what I mean? Word
Interviewer: You’ve got a lot of people. I mean, I’ve seen you at shows, I’ve seen you at shows that weren’t your own and you come in and basically hip hop fans give you more love, I would say, than most other artists. Because they feel like they know you, they feel like they can relate to you in some ways. Do you feel like you’ve got any sort of burden towards them, fulfilling their expectations of how you’re going to change and how your new life is going to go on? Do you feel like you want to talk to them at all about those things?
Dirty: I see it like this. It’s a new world order, you know what I mean? And one must adapt to that, you know? Or the penalty is the penalty, for real. I mean, I’m trying my best to adapt to all things, you know what I mean? It ain’t nothing like yeah, it’s new, word. And I advise that for anybody, you know? Control your emotions, you know? Because oh, it cause a lot of off-balance and things are not supposed to be always balanced, so it can spin you know what I mean? And I don’t know man, I just say that, man, word. But if anybody ever need my thoughts, ya'll know how to catch me. What’s my 1-900 line? Well next time when I come on ya’ll see my 900 line. Just go look in the Wu-Tang album cover, you will see my 1-900 line. Call me up, I will change the message too, so we can conversate more. Children, I love ya’ll, all right? Keep your head up
Interviewer: Tell me a little bit more about Mariah, your relationship with her? I have heard that has kind of grown a little bit over the last couple of years
Dirty: That’s my heartbeat. My sugar plum, word. One of the sweetest women I have met. I have met a lot of sweet women, well, my mama is the sweetest woman I ever met, and my grandmamma too, and a couple other women too. But Mariah got especially genuine, she ain’t got to say nothing, love. You know what I mean? She’s got like a glow, a weird glow. I can’t really explain it, you know? She’s just straight up beautiful, word. I mean, it’s shown and proved by all the fans she got, you know what I mean? See me, I’m a big fan of Mariah, word. Doing something with her, I always want to do some backup with her, when I was young I love Mariah. I mean not young, you know what I mean, before I was out. She just beautiful, you know. She keeps it real. She does what she feel at heart. And usually people when they do what they feel at heart, you’ve got good and bad in the situation. It means everything that she do is good, so I know she is a naturally good woman
Interviewer: And if you wanted to do something with her, she would be there for you? If you wanted to give her a call, she is always there for you?
Dirty: I hope so. Word. I believe so. I believe so, yes, of course
Interviewer: We have talked a little bit about your image, the one that has gone out about ODB over the past four or five years, and it’s a certain image that people have gotten used to. Do you have any desire to change that image as a result of your own life changes or do you think you are comfortable with the way that is?
Dirty: You love Dirty as Dirty, Dirty is Dirt Dog. How you see him is how you gonna get him. This is Dirty, baby. Shimmy-shimmy-ya, Brooklyn Zoo, The Stomp, approach a school 9:30, you’re late. Everybody go Dirt Dog, all that, that’s me, straight up – I can’t change that. That’s me, that’s going me – what started from that future, you know what I mean? Other than the bad parts. There wasn’t really no bad parts, though, other than people tearing down the clubs and stuff. I ain’t gonna tear down no more clubs, all right? Leave you bouncers alone because I love ya’ll anyway. I’m gonna be Dirty, word
Interviewer: Tell me what an average day is like now, as it was earlier this year, or something like that. Tell me what you do during an average day?
Dirty: I try to take care of more business now, you know? No more sleepy head. It’s all good
Interviewer: I mean, like what time do you get – I’m talking specific, because you know kind of want to know what your life is like. What time you get up, things like that?
Dirty: My life is your life, you know? I get up, I use the toilet bowl, sometimes I eat, sometimes I don’t. I love women. I love seeing people, I love seeing people happy. I don’t really know man, I’m me. I mean I don’t predict things. It comes natural where I get up and I’m happy, see? I’m happy, all right? And that’s about it. I can’t really tell you how Dirt Dog it is, it’s too exquisite. There’s nothing that you can just pinpoint, you know what I mean? It’s here, it’s there, it’s there, it’s everywhere, you know what I mean? So that’s all basically it, from the dirt in the air that you breathe
Interviewer: How far along are the plans for your next solo album? As far is somebody on the project as a producer, is RZA going to produce it? Have you started writing things?
Dirty: Yeah, RZA, Dirt Dog, we are going to try to get Dr. Dre. That’s my man, you got it going on, dunn for real, word is bond. Oh, Puffy, you ill too. Word. I want to give you props, [Puff 00:26:29], you’ve got it going on man. At first man, but now, man, you’ve got it going on. I’ve got to give you all your props, man. You got a standard, baby, keep it up. Whoever it is that got banging tracks, you know what I mean? Ain’t all looking pretty in the videos, ain’t all like – you know what I mean? Because everybody looking all pretty in the videos nowadays, you know what I mean? Dirty is going to bring back that light that you been missing, straight up, that – you know, the real stuff, that when you get up in the morning that’s how it is. Sometimes you wash up, sometimes you don’t, you know what I mean? You go outside, you know, there is nothing planned what Dirty’s going to do. Dirty’s going to do, you know, the regular thing – straight up man. I mean, I’m going to have a lot of producers, so I ain’t try to pick – whoever got the bangingest tracks, that’s who I’m using, word
Interviewer: When do you think this will be out?
Dirty: I’m going to try to have it out by spring
Interviewer: And are you writing lyrics right now or are you just going to wait until everything comes together?
Dirty: Oh, I’m planning on taking me a little day – you know what I mean? Like now getting off and just go and sit down, just vibe for about a month and just write, because I’ve got a lot of chambers full for ya’ll. Ya’ll don’t know nothing yet. Ya’ll think all this music out here now is it? Watch when you hear mine. For real, ya’ll going to like my album, I know ya’ll is. Because it’s going to attract the grandmothers, the great-grandmothers, the babies in the stomachs going to be kicking. You know, we might get a couple of UFO sightings here, you know what I mean? You never know, right in New York. You never know, messing around with my new album. Hey, Dirty ain’t cursing or nothing. So ya’ll see it’s good, you know what I mean? I ain’t gonna lie, [inaudible - 00:28:40], you know, but – you’re gonna see. I ain’t bragging or nothing, you’ll see. For those who like it, love it, for those who don’t, love it, all right?
Interviewer: As far as the album and projecting into your future, with the kids you’ve got to support, with the life you want to lead, you obviously want this album to have a certain level of success. So beyond the recording, are there any other plans as far as the publicity, how you’re going to kind of create a buzz around this album?
Dirty: I want to get to all, a little Western, country, jazz, rock and roll, heavy metal. My brother, he’s got a band out called Funk Face, so we’ll be teaming up real soon anyway. He is strictly like heavy metal, rock and roll? You know what I mean? I want to catch everybody. I already got all the hip hop fans. Hip hop belongs to me, you know what I mean? And that ain’t no lie. Because I let it all out, you know what I mean? So now it’s time to go into rock and roll. It’s time to go into whatever it is to go into, you know what I mean? One thing about Dirty’s world, Dirty can go into any chamber of 36 chambers, you know? And all will love it because I want to touch everybody. I want to touch everybody and that’s basically it. That’s basically it, word
Interviewer: Let me ask you a couple of questions about some other things that we’re working on. I know that you did a remix with a group called Texas, recently. Is that right?
Dirty: Me?
Interviewer: Yeah, supposably
Dirty: Texas? Got me
Interviewer: No, all right. Let me ask you about – Thanksgiving is coming up and we’re doing a Beavis and Butthead Thanksgiving special. Just curious what Thanksgiving means to you?
Dirty: Thanks for giving
Interviewer: How do you celebrate the holiday? With your family, at home?
Dirty: Well, me and RZA, when we was young we used to just go to everybody’s house and eat. You know, we travel from this house to we eat at this house, we eat and leave. Then we go to this house, we go to this house, and we go to this house, you know. Thanksgiving is a food day, man. You know what I mean, you eat a lot of food and everybody is happy. They are cooking together, it’s all good. It’s like one of them Christmas days, you know what I mean? Look, man, before I used to be all personal about things and man, that ain’t nothing like life, straight up. You know what I mean? We ain’t here just enjoying it, you know what I mean? People be so biased about how people are living, what people are doing – who cares what people are doing? People don’t understand what love is, you know what I mean? I ain’t being funny or nothing, but to me love is, you know, all right – you got lesbians, you faggots, whatever. You got, you know, me and a woman, you got whatever, whatever. To me love is all of that, you know what I mean? And people have got to start learning how to respect people as they is, you know what I’m saying? That’s how I see things, man. I mean, I ain’t into all that, but yo what, that’s there. What the fuck you gonna do – excuse me, my language, but what the hell you going to do about it? You can’t change that. Lord God made that, you know what I mean? So love is universal, man. You can’t stop nothing, you know what I mean? Ya’ll do what ya’ll do, you know what I mean? That’s all I will say. Enjoy your lives man, man. Word, word is mine. Enjoy your lives, you know what I mean? I love all, you know what I mean? To me, I’m a Dirty white boy. Cut my skin one of the first things you see is white meat, and you see blood, so it’s all good
Interviewer: That’s good, yeah
Male: We done? That’s it. All right
[End of Audio 00:33:22]
