Why havenāt you done an interview until now?
I felt like I had nothing to say. I still feel I have nothing to say. Iām the most boring person to talk to.
So why now? Is your label pushing you to do press for the album?
No, labels always push. I mean, Trilogy was a rerelease, but they still said, āMaybe you should do some interviews.ā Honestly, I want to do interviews now because itās one thing that I havenāt mastered. Even Prince did interviews. Michael did interviews. And I can tell in the interviews theyāre uncomfortable. Why are they doing this? Because they feel like they have to do it to be a complete artist. I felt like this was my time. And maybe I wouldnāt have done it if I thought you were an asshole. I probably would have been like, āFuck this guy.ā
Is the air of mystery intentional?
Yes and no. In the beginning, I was very insecure. I hated how I looked in pictures. I just fucking hated this shit, like, crop me out of this picture right now. I was very camera shy. People like hot girls, so I put my music to hot girls and it just became a trend. The whole āenigmatic artistā thing, I just ran with it. No one could find pictures of me. It reminded me of some villain shit. But you canāt escape the Internet. There are super fans, and I was really testing their patience. At the end of the day you canāt deny the music. That was my whole thing: Iām going to let the music speak for itself. Iāll show them that this is what I do. But Iām very good at letting shit slide. If I wasnātā¦
āyouād go crazy.
I feel like Iām already crazy. I just wouldnāt be able to focus on my music. If I didnāt let shit slide, Iād probably still be working on Echoes of Silence right now. But, I know how to let go of bullshit. And I know how to let go of unmixed and unmastered records. But not anymore. To me, this is my first album. Kiss Land is definitely my first album.
A fresh start.
Yeah, thatās why I didnāt want to mix and master House of Balloons or Thursday or Echoes of Silence. I didnāt feel like they were my albums. Those were my mixtapes.
It was a hell of a mixtape.
Yeah, man. I just wanted to make the greatest mixtape of all time, thatās all. And if I didnāt, I definitely made the longest mixtape of all time. [Laughs.]
Which of the three resonates with you the most?
House of Balloons is the most important for me because I spent the most time on it. I didnāt have a deadline for that. As soon as I put House of Balloons out, I let the world know Iām coming out with two more albums this year, so I had my own little deadline. Before House of Balloons, it was all freedom.
House of Balloons was actually supposed to have more songs than it does. I had so many records left, and then Take Care came through. āCrew Love,ā āShot for Me,ā and āThe Rideā were supposed to be on House of Balloons. I wanted to come out with like 14 records. I felt like āThe Rideā was the last one, and it wasnāt done yet. [Drake] heard it and he was like, āThis shitās crazy.ā
How did you give it to him? Was it just an instrumental?
Yeah, we were making the drum loop and...oh, man, I had smoked I donāt know how much weed. Even Drake, he came into that session and we were all smoked out. It was terrible how much weed smoke was in that room. I was surprised I could even hit a note. I had sung this melodyāit wasnāt a hook, just an unfinished lyric. And he liked it so much, he was like, āI need to have this, man.... I know Iāve already taken āShot for Meā and āCrew Loveā and this and that.ā And me, I was hungry at that time. I was like, āDude, take anything.ā At that point I was like, āHell, yeah.ā
In your mind, what was āThe Rideā supposed to be?
There are two ways of making music for me. Thereās a calculated routeālike, I know exactly what Iām going to do with this song. And then thereās the free mind. That was one of the free-minded records. It was all subconscious. Iāll make the music first and loop it, and then Iāll go into the booth and start singing almost 45 minutes straight. And these are not words; this is gibberish. Itās a songwriter language. There are lyrics on Thursday, I donāt even know what the fuck I said. āGoneā was a complete freestyle.
Isnāt that like eight minutes long?
[Laughs.] Yeah, exactly. With me, everything is a blank canvas. Iām painting this canvas by whipping the colors. I want to show the world that I can shit out albums like nothing.
The song āKiss Landā has a new level of musicality and thoughtfulness that seems apropos for your first major label release.
Iām all about evolution. Iām the first person to judge myself. I listen to my music and Iāll be like, āThis is shit.ā Everyone around me is like, āWhat the fuck is wrong with you?ā
What are some flaws you saw in your past three releases?
Just technical, musical stuff. And, of course, writing. Youāre bound to find flaws and repetition when you come out with three albums in one year. At that point I was very cavalier; I didnāt give a shit. Some people realize it and some donāt. Me, Iām very critical.
Iām not here to change or lie about what Iām going to do. What I sing about is what I sing about. But thereās a lot of cool twists with this album, because this album symbolizes everything that Iād never experienced in the past 21 years of my life. Iād never left Toronto. Iād driven to Montreal, but Iād never been on a plane before two or three years ago.
Wow. Thatās crazy.
From when I was born to when I was 21, I never left Toronto. Thatās why Iām such a city cat. Trilogy is my experiences in those four walls. Kiss Land is me doing the things I did in Trilogy in different settings. [Laughs.]
My favorite of the Trilogy set, which goes against conventional wisdom, is Echoes of Silence.
Really, the last one? Echoes of Silence was made in Montreal. I had a lot of darkness in that city.
My favorite song on that project is āNext.ā
Thatās an artistās song. If youāre an artist, you can relate to that record. Especially if youāre in that hip-hop world, āNextā is for you.
Itās that balance of high and low. To start a song off, āShe pops that pussy on a Monday.ā Where is this going from there?
Iām a huge fan of R. Kellyās. Heās a musical genius, and probably the most prolific artist of the generation before mine. Some of the lines he says, if you say them in a normal voice, itās the most disgusting thing you could say to somebody. But I can say āPussy-ass n***aā in the most elegant and sexiest way ever, and itās accepted. If I can get away with singing that, Iām doing something right.
All that ignorance on my records ā āWhen she put it in her mouth, she canāt seem to reach myā¦ā ā thatās me paying homage to R. Kelly, and even Prince to a certain extent. The things R. Kelly was saying were crazy. You can say it now and itās nothing, but back then you couldnāt.
Since Trilogy, youāve made songs with Wiz, Juicy J, French Montana, Drake
They are all friends of mine. Every time Wiz came to Toronto, my friend would take me to his concerts and bring me backstage. To this day, heās the realest dude ever. So when he asked me to work with him, I did it without hesitation.
When you do a feature for other artists, do you give them an entire song?
With āCrew Love,ā it wasnāt like that. Like I said, that was my song. I had a hook and I had a second verse. And Drake heard it and he was like, āFuck, man.ā
Thereās a second verse?
Yeah, there was a second verse on it.
Youāve got to play that for me!
I fucking hate that second verse. That was a complete freestyle as well. Iām glad Drake placed his vocals on it. That song was so special to him. I didnāt hear that verse until maybe four or five months after I gave it to him. Even with āThe Zone,ā I was scared I was going to have to put out Thursday before his verse came in because Drake takes his time. He makes sure that he says the right shit and his flow is on point.
It seems like your work on Take Care was similar to the way Kanye West enlisted Kid Cudi on 808s & Heartbreak.
Or when Jay-Z hit up Kanye for The Blueprint.
Do you think Drake tapped you to give Take Care that feel?
Yeah, he told me he wouldnāt be able to do the album without me. You can read it on the credits that he thanked me. I donāt know if thatās him being generous, but I gave him a lot of records. I made āPractice.ā
What did you do on āPracticeā?
That whole hook was me. Thatās probably the only song I wrote for Take Care. The rest of it was just shit I was going to have for [House of Balloons]. He really wanted to incorporate my sound, which was inspired by his sound. Itās not like, āOh, I had the ānew sound.āā It was just easier for him to relate to me, because it was his sound with an edge. It was that Toronto sound. So yeah, youāre right. I feel like I could have been that for his album.
People think you guys arenāt cool with each other anymore.
No, thatās not true. Definitely not true. But it makes sense. The thing about Drake is I told him what my decisions were going to be. And he was down with it from the beginning.
You mean in terms of your label deal?
Everything. I told him from day one what my decision was going to be. I wasnāt going that route. I was going to go my own route. And he supported me.
So when you read things about how you two are not coolā¦
ā heās like me when it comes to shit like that, too. He loves reading that stuff.
You both just brush it off?
Of course. I donāt like to spoon-feed people. I donāt like to be like, āYou know what? Iām going to let the world know that weāre cool. Weāre going to take a picture together. Everyoneās cool.ā Itās all about the mystery, and people like it. Shitās WWE, man. Itās wrestling, you know what I mean?
The other rumor is that you two are PartyNextDoor.
[Laughs.] No, no, no, thatās not true at all. I never met him.
Where do you see yourself in the world of R&B?
The only thing R&B about my shit is the style of singing. My inspiration is R. Kelly, Michael Jackson, and Prince, for the vocals anyway. My production and songwriting, and the environment around those vocals are not inspired by R&B at all.
I heard Portishead drums on āBelong to the World.ā
Yeah, that was the inspiration behind that. I wrote a letter to the producers of Portishead and let them know this album is inspired by them.
The entire Kiss Land album?
Most of it. I find a sound and run with it. It varies from Stevie Nicks to Genesis and Phil Collins. The production is very cinematic for me, and R&B was never cinematic like that.
Do you have a greater understanding of love on this album?
I donāt know. Like I said, a lot of itās subconscious.
On āBelong to the World,ā it sounds like you may have had a serious relationship.
āBelong to the Worldā is about falling in love with the wrong person. There are some songs where I talk about the same person, but I like to make every song about someone else. Thursday is a conceptual album. Whatever that situation was, I spent the whole album focusing on that situation.
Have you gone through heartbreak before?
I think I did. Iām not sure. Some people think they go through situations and then it hits them like a fucking brick. I hope that I fell in love and I hope that my heart was broken. Because if I didnāt, then I donāt know what Iām about to go through in the next 20 years of my life.
Last night in the studio you said Kiss Land was a ridiculous title.
Yeah, because Kiss Land symbolizes the tour life, but itās a world that I created in my head. Just like House of Balloons symbolizes Toronto and my experiences there, but itās a world that I created. When I think about Kiss Land, I think about a terrifying place. Itās a place Iāve never been to before that Iām very unfamiliar with.
A lot of it is inspired by filmmakers like John Carpenter, David Cronenberg, and Ridley Scott, because they know how to capture fear. Thatās what Kiss Land is to me, an environment thatās just honest fear. I donāt know who I am right now and Iām doing all these outlandish things in these settings that Iām not familiar with. To me, itās the most terrifying thing ever. So when you hear the screams in the record and you hear all these horror references and you feel scared, listen to the music because I want you to feel what Iām feeling. Kiss Land is like a horror movie
Holy shit. Thatās the last thing youād expect from the title.
I didnāt want to call it Dark World or something so generic. The title came from a conversation that I overheard and those words stuck out. Someone said, āKiss Landā and I thought, āThatās going to be the title of my album.ā It sounds so ridiculous. When I put [the title] out everyone was like, āWhat the hell? This is going to be corny. Itās going to be all lovey-dovey.ā
People will say, āItās a wrap; we lost him.ā
But thatās what I want. I want them to be underwhelmed. Iām all about surprises. If you watch a horror movie and itās called Kiss Land, itās probably going to be the most terrifying thing youāve ever seen in your life.